Recently saw a line in a conservative editorial that "every antisemitic hammer sees the problem as a Jewish nail." As for Lorde, Dua Lipa, really any performer who goes out of their way to bash Israel while it struggles for survival while surrounded by enemies in a hateful world, I lose the ability to enjoy their talent. Their politics colors my view of them, like a taste of something you thought might be sweet and you would enjoy, but instead it is bitter and disappointing. My loss I guess, but one I don't miss, as if a $20 bill I didn't know was there fell out of my pocket. I don't miss it. I listened to "What was That" forgetting it was Glastonbury and "free palestine' and all the baggage that goes with that phrase, like setting Jews afire in Boulder, CO, and shooting a young Jewish couple dead in Washington D.C. A phrase uttered while murdering Jews. I found the song and video awesome when I could forget it was Glastonbury and Lorde is "free palestine" and WTF was that? But when I listened a second time with Lorde's anti-Israel and the crowd's Jew hatred in mind, "What was That" became lame, phony, performative, and sad. Maybe a defense mechanism from childhood, once I know or suspect a person dislikes me, their opinion means nothing to me. My loss I guess because what was awesome turned sour.
I have to say that I have extreme difficulty getting past the “anti Zionist” which is really “Jew Hater”.. I sing and have tons of music to listen to.. but I won’t play Dua Lipa and I haven’t played Roger Waters’ Radio KAOS since about 1990… but there is Eric Clapton’s Behind the Sun on my phone and I haven’t deleted it yet.. there must be some sort of defiance associated with it, like when my cousins from Herzliya went to London as an act of defiance. My cousin’s daughter lived there for years and I know she is disgusted with what she saw… still there is a love associated with being an NME critic and you seem to enjoy handling that role with aplomb. Understanding music is in your DNA. It does pain me that so many artists feel that it is vogue to hate us…. I guess I will nod off to listening to Adrian Belew’s Big Electric Cat, running through my head..
Frenetic passion. I don't know what I think about it yet, but I don't expect Lorde to wait for my opinion. De gustibus non disputandum est. I just know, Eve, that I appreciate your opening another window, another door, that would otherwise remain shut and unnoticed.
I cannot separate the art from the artist. I have my Dead To Me list, Lorde has been on it a long time and will continue to stay on it. I don’t feel I am depriving myself of anything by refusing to contribute to the salary or normalization of an antisemite.
A "dead to me" list. That's a great name for that list and now I too have a name that list of Jew haters. I hope that some will see the light and help shorten the list.
My daughters got me into Lorde and we went to see her twice in her early days in Seattle and San Diego. Amazing performances. But I tuned out after her cancelling the Israel tour, that left a real bitter taste. You ignored it and listened. Thanks, maybe I should do too.
Although this piece is not necessarily about how this artist is an anti-Zionist, and I see how you wanted to give her credit…it was hard to digest and continue reading. I also would not listen to her because it is difficult to enjoy a song when the artist believes you should not exist.
I struggle with this regarding art and artists, unfortunately with increasing frequency. I bought several songs from Pure Heroin and Melodrama but stopped listening to them back when she cancelled her Israel tour. A combination of just not enjoying them the same anymore, and a sense of I don’t need this person’s voice or subliminal messages in my head. I certainly won’t knowingly pay money to any supporters of Jew hatred in any of its permutations. What — is using my money that way too Jew-y?
I also think the anonymity of buying music allows us to mind-f*ck ourselves. If instead I picture myself sitting in a concert hall and having a spotlight put on me as it’s announced from the stage, “You, Zionist, you are not welcome here.” Would I really stay?
P.S. At 16, I would have been thrilled with that review
P.P.S.S. I know, I know, I don’t police other purchases quite the same - did Uighur slaves make that blouse from China?- but the spiritual component of art makes it feel different
This is a problem with creatives which has never been resolved. Are you moral if you appreciate the art of someone who is inherently evil. Not saying that Lorde is evil, but her actions are part of a larger evil process that is working against the Jewish people. It's I think what is meant by idle worship. The old definition of idol worship States that idle worship causes pleasure to the worshiper. As jews, we are torn between engaging in the larger culture, or retreating to our ghettos and our traditions. Inevitably, the larger culture swings around and tries to cut us off at the knees as it has for thousands of years. Our answer has always been to retreat. I would argue, that despite song being a banger we need to put our own traditions first. Find a banger who doesn't want us dead. We have to actively push against those who hate us. We can't simply give up because it's easier. Because we want to dance to that song.
I guess that's really the issue. The catharsis. I grew up as an orthodox jew. I'm no longer that observant. But a part of me still feels guilty when engaging in pleasures which my upbringing would consider sinful. Eve, as far as I'm concerned, you are a powerful individual. What you say counts more than most. I appreciate you exposing your vulnerability and your love of music. And I understand the frustration of having to weigh one's love of music against one's hate of the artist or at least this particular artist's attitudes toward us. I don't mean to accuse, I'm just sharing my feelings.
This topic reminds me of an excellent documentary that I watched many years ago, entitled "We Want to Light," by filmaker Christopher Nupen (highly recommended, and if you like documentaries about classical musicians, he is your guy). It is centered around classical music, rather than popular music, and contains many interviews with brilliant classical musicians, including Itzhak Perlman, Vladimir Ashkenazy, Barenboim, etc. They discuss the music of German composers, particularly Wagner (I believe the film was made shortly after Wagner was first played in Israel).
I do not remember the film very well because I saw it many years ago, but one interview in particular that has stuck in my head over the years is with Toby Perlman (Itzhak's wife): She describes being young and hearing the music of an incredible "new" composer for the first time and being completely blown away by it. Turns out the music was Wagner's, which her parents had never allowed to be played in their house, although they agreed with her that it was uniquely powerful in its own way. Another musician, I think maybe Barenboim or Itzhak Perlman, made the point that if we filtered out all of the antisemitic composers from classical music and other great art, we would have very little left to appreciate.
All that to say that it is very complicated and hard to know how and when one can separate an artist from their art. For me, Clapton's music (the good early and bluesy stuff, not the pop fluff) was a very big deal for me for decades. But seeing the photo of him with the jihad flag guitar was like getting a knife in my heart. I personally cannot listen to him anymore, at least not for now, but if other people can separate his music from his stupidity then that is their right.
It’s like forgiving Mahmoud Khalil for actively chanting death to the Jews on campus not so long ago. This moron is now filling a $20M claim against the Trump administration by the way.
Once a terrorist, always a terrorist. Same for Lipa and Lorde my tuchas.
Eve, you are powerful and moving and a far better person than I am. Ok, I still love most Pink Floyd music despite the execrable Waters. Mostly, I excise the despicable assholes who chant death to the IDF frommy list, although I love Royals.. Our son was a Chayal Boded Tzanchan Krevi, so that may be part of it.
You have music coursing through you very being, and your comments show you strength to be able to hold opposing thoughts and feelings in your head at the same time. I can as well, but differently. I can't hold a candle (cell phone?) To you...
I am a painter. I feel alone too. On another note (musical or rhetorical) you have grown dear. I see the arc in your trajectory of slips slides and surges. Dont you want to interview Lorde… find the common ground of understanding? I would love to hear it!
I used to avoid music, writing, art and all the culture produced by antisemites as a way of fighting back. Boycotting, divesting and sanctioning in my own little way. But now I feel that unless the piece is in itself a vessel for Jew hatred that I will enjoy it if it appeals to me. That doesn’t mean I excuse the creator’s politics. I don’t.
Recently saw a line in a conservative editorial that "every antisemitic hammer sees the problem as a Jewish nail." As for Lorde, Dua Lipa, really any performer who goes out of their way to bash Israel while it struggles for survival while surrounded by enemies in a hateful world, I lose the ability to enjoy their talent. Their politics colors my view of them, like a taste of something you thought might be sweet and you would enjoy, but instead it is bitter and disappointing. My loss I guess, but one I don't miss, as if a $20 bill I didn't know was there fell out of my pocket. I don't miss it. I listened to "What was That" forgetting it was Glastonbury and "free palestine' and all the baggage that goes with that phrase, like setting Jews afire in Boulder, CO, and shooting a young Jewish couple dead in Washington D.C. A phrase uttered while murdering Jews. I found the song and video awesome when I could forget it was Glastonbury and Lorde is "free palestine" and WTF was that? But when I listened a second time with Lorde's anti-Israel and the crowd's Jew hatred in mind, "What was That" became lame, phony, performative, and sad. Maybe a defense mechanism from childhood, once I know or suspect a person dislikes me, their opinion means nothing to me. My loss I guess because what was awesome turned sour.
I have to say that I have extreme difficulty getting past the “anti Zionist” which is really “Jew Hater”.. I sing and have tons of music to listen to.. but I won’t play Dua Lipa and I haven’t played Roger Waters’ Radio KAOS since about 1990… but there is Eric Clapton’s Behind the Sun on my phone and I haven’t deleted it yet.. there must be some sort of defiance associated with it, like when my cousins from Herzliya went to London as an act of defiance. My cousin’s daughter lived there for years and I know she is disgusted with what she saw… still there is a love associated with being an NME critic and you seem to enjoy handling that role with aplomb. Understanding music is in your DNA. It does pain me that so many artists feel that it is vogue to hate us…. I guess I will nod off to listening to Adrian Belew’s Big Electric Cat, running through my head..
Yes, losing Clapton really hurt. He's a fucking moronic old man, but a great guitarist.
Frenetic passion. I don't know what I think about it yet, but I don't expect Lorde to wait for my opinion. De gustibus non disputandum est. I just know, Eve, that I appreciate your opening another window, another door, that would otherwise remain shut and unnoticed.
Beautiful piece and evidence of your commitment to authenticity and sheer courage.
I cannot separate the art from the artist. I have my Dead To Me list, Lorde has been on it a long time and will continue to stay on it. I don’t feel I am depriving myself of anything by refusing to contribute to the salary or normalization of an antisemite.
A "dead to me" list. That's a great name for that list and now I too have a name that list of Jew haters. I hope that some will see the light and help shorten the list.
My daughters got me into Lorde and we went to see her twice in her early days in Seattle and San Diego. Amazing performances. But I tuned out after her cancelling the Israel tour, that left a real bitter taste. You ignored it and listened. Thanks, maybe I should do too.
You’re the absolute best! Thank you Eve.💙🤙🏼
Although this piece is not necessarily about how this artist is an anti-Zionist, and I see how you wanted to give her credit…it was hard to digest and continue reading. I also would not listen to her because it is difficult to enjoy a song when the artist believes you should not exist.
I struggle with this regarding art and artists, unfortunately with increasing frequency. I bought several songs from Pure Heroin and Melodrama but stopped listening to them back when she cancelled her Israel tour. A combination of just not enjoying them the same anymore, and a sense of I don’t need this person’s voice or subliminal messages in my head. I certainly won’t knowingly pay money to any supporters of Jew hatred in any of its permutations. What — is using my money that way too Jew-y?
I also think the anonymity of buying music allows us to mind-f*ck ourselves. If instead I picture myself sitting in a concert hall and having a spotlight put on me as it’s announced from the stage, “You, Zionist, you are not welcome here.” Would I really stay?
P.S. At 16, I would have been thrilled with that review
P.P.S.S. I know, I know, I don’t police other purchases quite the same - did Uighur slaves make that blouse from China?- but the spiritual component of art makes it feel different
This is a problem with creatives which has never been resolved. Are you moral if you appreciate the art of someone who is inherently evil. Not saying that Lorde is evil, but her actions are part of a larger evil process that is working against the Jewish people. It's I think what is meant by idle worship. The old definition of idol worship States that idle worship causes pleasure to the worshiper. As jews, we are torn between engaging in the larger culture, or retreating to our ghettos and our traditions. Inevitably, the larger culture swings around and tries to cut us off at the knees as it has for thousands of years. Our answer has always been to retreat. I would argue, that despite song being a banger we need to put our own traditions first. Find a banger who doesn't want us dead. We have to actively push against those who hate us. We can't simply give up because it's easier. Because we want to dance to that song.
You are daring to tell me that in a moment of desperation for emotional catharsis I am giving up? I am not just a Jew you know. I’m also a human.
I really hate that we have to make these choices. It seems, that both of them are bad.
I guess that's really the issue. The catharsis. I grew up as an orthodox jew. I'm no longer that observant. But a part of me still feels guilty when engaging in pleasures which my upbringing would consider sinful. Eve, as far as I'm concerned, you are a powerful individual. What you say counts more than most. I appreciate you exposing your vulnerability and your love of music. And I understand the frustration of having to weigh one's love of music against one's hate of the artist or at least this particular artist's attitudes toward us. I don't mean to accuse, I'm just sharing my feelings.
This topic reminds me of an excellent documentary that I watched many years ago, entitled "We Want to Light," by filmaker Christopher Nupen (highly recommended, and if you like documentaries about classical musicians, he is your guy). It is centered around classical music, rather than popular music, and contains many interviews with brilliant classical musicians, including Itzhak Perlman, Vladimir Ashkenazy, Barenboim, etc. They discuss the music of German composers, particularly Wagner (I believe the film was made shortly after Wagner was first played in Israel).
I do not remember the film very well because I saw it many years ago, but one interview in particular that has stuck in my head over the years is with Toby Perlman (Itzhak's wife): She describes being young and hearing the music of an incredible "new" composer for the first time and being completely blown away by it. Turns out the music was Wagner's, which her parents had never allowed to be played in their house, although they agreed with her that it was uniquely powerful in its own way. Another musician, I think maybe Barenboim or Itzhak Perlman, made the point that if we filtered out all of the antisemitic composers from classical music and other great art, we would have very little left to appreciate.
All that to say that it is very complicated and hard to know how and when one can separate an artist from their art. For me, Clapton's music (the good early and bluesy stuff, not the pop fluff) was a very big deal for me for decades. But seeing the photo of him with the jihad flag guitar was like getting a knife in my heart. I personally cannot listen to him anymore, at least not for now, but if other people can separate his music from his stupidity then that is their right.
It’s like forgiving Mahmoud Khalil for actively chanting death to the Jews on campus not so long ago. This moron is now filling a $20M claim against the Trump administration by the way.
Once a terrorist, always a terrorist. Same for Lipa and Lorde my tuchas.
Your brilliant writing, Eve, deserves subjects who do not proudly embrace Jew hate.
Eve, you are powerful and moving and a far better person than I am. Ok, I still love most Pink Floyd music despite the execrable Waters. Mostly, I excise the despicable assholes who chant death to the IDF frommy list, although I love Royals.. Our son was a Chayal Boded Tzanchan Krevi, so that may be part of it.
You have music coursing through you very being, and your comments show you strength to be able to hold opposing thoughts and feelings in your head at the same time. I can as well, but differently. I can't hold a candle (cell phone?) To you...
I am a painter. I feel alone too. On another note (musical or rhetorical) you have grown dear. I see the arc in your trajectory of slips slides and surges. Dont you want to interview Lorde… find the common ground of understanding? I would love to hear it!
I used to avoid music, writing, art and all the culture produced by antisemites as a way of fighting back. Boycotting, divesting and sanctioning in my own little way. But now I feel that unless the piece is in itself a vessel for Jew hatred that I will enjoy it if it appeals to me. That doesn’t mean I excuse the creator’s politics. I don’t.